So far, even though I love the more balanced weapons and such, do you think Soldat 1.3 will have a steeper learning curve? With the weapon editor, and 50% of servers either using 1.2's weapons or having totally edited weapons?
Do you also think this will give newer players the opportunity to totally 'pwn' older players from the likes of 1.2 and 1.2.1?

Please don't turn this into a hate or flame thread, either.

I'm not really sure on this subject. Since ruger is what I use, I'll comment on that.

For ruger, I'm pretty sure the learning curve will be quite a bit steeper than in 1.2.1, with slightly lowered damage and the slower reload, it doesn't have as many advantages as it used to. Newbies trying to use ruger will most likely get ripped apart by the mp5 and steyr. It's actually quite hard for me to comment on this, I can't remember what it's like to play without knowing how to dodge stuff and knowing maps very well.

However, overall for 1.3, I don't think the learning curve will escalate too much, it's not really that much more difficult to learn how to play than it used to be, it's still pretty simple :D

As for what you said about pwning older players, that is a possibility. Various other people have mentioned that since being vets from other versions, you now have to basically relearn all the weapons. Thankfully, this doesn't affect me too much, which is nice. So yeh, it's a possibility, but the general playing experience of the vets will allow them to triumph over newbs.

I'm pretty seasoned as far as Soldat is concerned, perhaps a neo veteran since I came in just after 1.2 had hit. But I still remember learning Soldat, and playing it for the first time, being totally addicted to the chaos of it. But I also remember learning about the weapons, which was a little faster for me since I had a friend telling me what everything was, basically.

I have to guess from my experiences compared to how Soldat is now that it won't be too bad for the new players. I mean the new people are already drawn to things like the Barret, which is just same ol' Barret, the M79, no comment, and the Mini, which has gotten better since 1.2. They'll probably then either learn to use a machine gun, or one of the other "two-hit-kill" weapons, depending on style. And none of them have changed dramatically. Most people exaggerate when they talk about the nerfing that took place in 2.3.

All in all, I think everything will be fine, and no one will be the wiser. And as for the vets getting pwnd because of the changes, I think that if any of the vets can't adapt it just shows what poor gaming skills they have. And if the new players can learn faster than they can relearn, than I think that just shows the mettle of the new generation of Soldat players.

~TheRelinquished

Anyone getting owned because of the changes can't be called a vet tbh.

quote:Originally posted by OutcastAnyone getting owned because of the changes can't be called a vet tbh.


This quote I can agree with :\ Once you play soldat for awhile at least for me I have hardly any trouble adjusting to the new version :\

soldat has always been easy to get into, after you get into the physics. you get pretty fast into "level 10", unfortunately, the new guys get too good in such short time, and the oldies dont really develop anymore

Ah, but that's good. Do you think that Soldat is not so newb-friendly now? And if it isn't, is that a good or bad thing? A lot of experienced players were saying in 1.2.1 that it didn't take any skill or time to become a good player. I kind of took that as a truth since so many "experienced" players arose during that time. Maybe it would be harder and more challenging for newbies to get to a high level of skill in 1.3?

if weapons took longer too kill, then the game would take more skill.

I have to agree with jaz, unfortunately.
But you can't change barret to a 2 hit weapon.
Or m79. So you can't really reduce the dmg to less then atm.

Well, seeing as I only recently began to get "good" as in having more kills than deaths every game. This will make me have to relearn tactics. So for someone who had played before 1.3, it will get a bit steeper. But probably not for new players, as they will only percieve this new balance as normal, and won't be "mentally" affected by it like some of us are.

I think the shotgun seems to be the best weapon here. It maintains (I think) all of its original 1.2.1 statistics and all the other weapons seem to have been affected in some other way (in a bad way); weakening of shots (D'Eagles), longer reload rate (Ruger), self-bink (even though bursting's really easy to do)... click-wait (freakin' 1.3 LAW)!! The shotgun even has more of a kickback so you can use it kind of as a jet-boot enhancement, so it's been improved IMO when everything else has stayed the same or downgraded. It might become a bit too powerful, but most of the n00bs won't recognize that ACT (at least, at first; they'll think serial killers with it have been playing for a while since the arc is supposedly weird to most).

Then again there's the Chainsaw with its improved melee distance xD

I agree with Zamorak, BTW.

Hehe, I can hear them now "Stop spassurfing, noob!".
I really think that the law is WAY harder to use, now you have to THINK more when using it.

quote:Originally posted by ráz0rif weapons took longer too kill, then the game would take more skill.

exactly

quote:Originally posted by Keron Cyst I think the shotgun seems to be the best weapon here. It maintains (I think) all of its original 1.2.1 statistics and all the other weapons seem to have been affected in some other way (in a bad way); weakening of shots (D'Eagles), longer reload rate (Ruger), self-bink (even though bursting's really easy to do)... click-wait (freakin' 1.3 LAW)!! The shotgun even has more of a kickback so you can use it kind of as a jet-boot enhancement, so it's been improved IMO when everything else has stayed the same or downgraded. It might become a bit too powerful, but most of the n00bs won't recognize that ACT (at least, at first; they'll think serial killers with it have been playing for a while since the arc is supposedly weird to most).

m79 is still good , so is the barret , like you said, bursting in autos helps.

I totally disagree with you in the freaking 1.3 LAW part, LAW has become more challenging, It's a one kill shot for god's sake, Do you expect it to auto-aim and lock on enemies? It has to be hard just like the barret and m79.

quote:Originally posted by GunPowderquote:Originally posted by ráz0rif weapons took longer too kill, then the game would take more skill.

exactly

quote:Originally posted by Keron Cyst I think the shotgun seems to be the best weapon here. It maintains (I think) all of its original 1.2.1 statistics and all the other weapons seem to have been affected in some other way (in a bad way); weakening of shots (D'Eagles), longer reload rate (Ruger), self-bink (even though bursting's really easy to do)... click-wait (freakin' 1.3 LAW)!! The shotgun even has more of a kickback so you can use it kind of as a jet-boot enhancement, so it's been improved IMO when everything else has stayed the same or downgraded. It might become a bit too powerful, but most of the n00bs won't recognize that ACT (at least, at first; they'll think serial killers with it have been playing for a while since the arc is supposedly weird to most).

m79 is still good , so is the barret , like you said, bursting in autos helps.

I totally disagree with you in the freaking 1.3 LAW part, LAW has become more challenging, It's a one kill shot for god's sake, Do you expect it to auto-aim and lock on enemies? It has to be hard just like the barret and m79.


I'm sorry to completely bust this theory of yours. But, law right now is a LOT harder then barret OR m79. Before it was something alike. m79 and barret don't have click and hold technique. If they did, nobody would hit for (Please refrain from swearing).

I know it's a LOT harder,but it isn't impossible, all you need to do is to aim after hearing the click not starting to aim from the beginning, or you can aim at the point where the enemy is moving to.

quote:Originally posted by Outcastquote:Originally posted by GunPowderquote:Originally posted by ráz0rif weapons took longer too kill, then the game would take more skill.

exactly

quote:Originally posted by Keron Cyst I think the shotgun seems to be the best weapon here. It maintains (I think) all of its original 1.2.1 statistics and all the other weapons seem to have been affected in some other way (in a bad way); weakening of shots (D'Eagles), longer reload rate (Ruger), self-bink (even though bursting's really easy to do)... click-wait (freakin' 1.3 LAW)!! The shotgun even has more of a kickback so you can use it kind of as a jet-boot enhancement, so it's been improved IMO when everything else has stayed the same or downgraded. It might become a bit too powerful, but most of the n00bs won't recognize that ACT (at least, at first; they'll think serial killers with it have been playing for a while since the arc is supposedly weird to most).

m79 is still good , so is the barret , like you said, bursting in autos helps.

I totally disagree with you in the freaking 1.3 LAW part, LAW has become more challenging, It's a one kill shot for god's sake, Do you expect it to auto-aim and lock on enemies? It has to be hard just like the barret and m79.


I'm sorry to completely bust this theory of yours. But, law right now is a LOT harder then barret OR m79. Before it was something alike. m79 and barret don't have click and hold technique. If they did, nobody would hit for (Please refrain from swearing).

Yes but the law is a SECONDARY, and should not come close to a primary in usefullness.

Wow, so many things to say. Let's begin, shall we?

quote:Originally posted by ráz0r

if weapons took longer too kill, then the game would take more skill.

Yes, this is true. However, this would also rob from the fast-pacedness of the game, which is something that makes it so fun and addicting. We don't want to just end up with a 2D sidescrolling version of CS.

quote: Originally posted by Keron Cyst

I think the shotgun seems to be the best weapon here. It maintains (I think) all of its original 1.2.1 statistics and all the other weapons seem to have been affected in some other way (in a bad way); weakening of shots (D'Eagles), longer reload rate (Ruger), self-bink (even though bursting's really easy to do)... click-wait (freakin' 1.3 LAW)!! The shotgun even has more of a kickback so you can use it kind of as a jet-boot enhancement, so it's been improved IMO when everything else has stayed the same or downgraded. It might become a bit too powerful, but most of the n00bs won't recognize that ACT (at least, at first; they'll think serial killers with it have been playing for a while since the arc is supposedly weird to most).

Then again there's the Chainsaw with its improved melee distance xD

Actually the shotgun did see some other change, in that it lost some of its damage. Most people don't even notice because they didn't use it to begin with, but it used to be a death sentence to be wthin an inch or two of a shotgunner. But now the range is increased, making it a worthy mid-ranged weapon, but the damage is reduced to balance out. The kick-back is just a minor feature that has little advantages and disadvantages.

As for the chainsaw, it really needed that improved distance. I still think it's underpowered compared to the knife, but at least it's coming along.

quote: Originally posted by GunPowder

I totally disagree with you in the freaking 1.3 LAW part, LAW has become more challenging, It's a one kill shot for god's sake, Do you expect it to auto-aim and lock on enemies? It has to be hard just like the barret and m79.

I agree with GunPowder here, and also with Vendetta's statement that this is a secondary weapon and that it shouldn't be as good as a primary weapon. If you simply wait to aim after you here the click, you won't notice the difference. And I've even heard of people who claim to aim "better" with this strategy. It's always been an overpowered weapon, and it shouldn't be a guaranteed kill for every spawn. No secondary weapon should be that good. The others require a level of skill, precision, and/or timing to use, and the LAW should be no different.

"If I can't rely on the system, then there's something wrong with the system."

~TheRelinquished

quote:Originally posted by Vendettaquote:Originally posted by Outcastquote:Originally posted by GunPowderquote:Originally posted by ráz0rif weapons took longer too kill, then the game would take more skill.

exactly

quote:Originally posted by Keron Cyst I think the shotgun seems to be the best weapon here. It maintains (I think) all of its original 1.2.1 statistics and all the other weapons seem to have been affected in some other way (in a bad way); weakening of shots (D'Eagles), longer reload rate (Ruger), self-bink (even though bursting's really easy to do)... click-wait (freakin' 1.3 LAW)!! The shotgun even has more of a kickback so you can use it kind of as a jet-boot enhancement, so it's been improved IMO when everything else has stayed the same or downgraded. It might become a bit too powerful, but most of the n00bs won't recognize that ACT (at least, at first; they'll think serial killers with it have been playing for a while since the arc is supposedly weird to most).

m79 is still good , so is the barret , like you said, bursting in autos helps.

I totally disagree with you in the freaking 1.3 LAW part, LAW has become more challenging, It's a one kill shot for god's sake, Do you expect it to auto-aim and lock on enemies? It has to be hard just like the barret and m79.


I'm sorry to completely bust this theory of yours. But, law right now is a LOT harder then barret OR m79. Before it was something alike. m79 and barret don't have click and hold technique. If they did, nobody would hit for (Please refrain from swearing).

Yes but the law is a SECONDARY, and should not come close to a primary in usefullness.


So what? I switched to SOCOM now just because i find it a lot easier to use, hell it might take "6" shots to kill but atleast i can hit almost every shot no matter how the guy is moving. Even knife is easier to use and it's supposed to be "pro", hell maybe even chainsaw. LAW has become the hardest weapon ;p

I love the new chainsaw, it's much easier to use in this version than in the older ones, ak/chainsaw pwns. LAW has gotten what it deserves! But I think barret has gone to 1.1.5 style, don't you think? Alltho they didn't mention changes in barret anywhere..

quote:Originally posted by Outcastquote:Originally posted by Vendettaquote:Originally posted by Outcastquote:Originally posted by GunPowderquote:Originally posted by ráz0rif weapons took longer too kill, then the game would take more skill.

exactly

quote:Originally posted by Keron Cyst I think the shotgun seems to be the best weapon here. It maintains (I think) all of its original 1.2.1 statistics and all the other weapons seem to have been affected in some other way (in a bad way); weakening of shots (D'Eagles), longer reload rate (Ruger), self-bink (even though bursting's really easy to do)... click-wait (freakin' 1.3 LAW)!! The shotgun even has more of a kickback so you can use it kind of as a jet-boot enhancement, so it's been improved IMO when everything else has stayed the same or downgraded. It might become a bit too powerful, but most of the n00bs won't recognize that ACT (at least, at first; they'll think serial killers with it have been playing for a while since the arc is supposedly weird to most).

m79 is still good , so is the barret , like you said, bursting in autos helps.

I totally disagree with you in the freaking 1.3 LAW part, LAW has become more challenging, It's a one kill shot for god's sake, Do you expect it to auto-aim and lock on enemies? It has to be hard just like the barret and m79.


I'm sorry to completely bust this theory of yours. But, law right now is a LOT harder then barret OR m79. Before it was something alike. m79 and barret don't have click and hold technique. If they did, nobody would hit for (Please refrain from swearing).

Yes but the law is a SECONDARY, and should not come close to a primary in usefullness.


So what? I switched to SOCOM now just because i find it a lot easier to use, hell it might take "6" shots to kill but atleast i can hit almost every shot no matter how the guy is moving. Even knife is easier to use and it's supposed to be "pro", hell maybe even chainsaw. LAW has become the hardest weapon ;p

man that looks cool!

back on topic- soldat is a great game that is challenging yet sayisfying, and is a fun game that's easy to learn for all ages. a little more strategy in 1.3, but it's still good ol' soldat.

english: i think soldat will have a slightly steeper learning curve, but it will still have the newbs that pwn everybody now and then.

quote:Originally posted by BugI love the new chainsaw, it's much easier to use in this version than in the older ones, ak/chainsaw pwns. LAW has gotten what it deserves! But I think barret has gone to 1.1.5 style, don't you think? Alltho they didn't mention changes in barret anywhere..



Because there weren't any changes.

quote:Originally posted by TheRelinquishedI'm pretty seasoned as far as Soldat is concerned, perhaps a neo veteran since I came in just after 1.2 had hit. But I still remember learning Soldat, and playing it for the first time, being totally addicted to the chaos of it. But I also remember learning about the weapons, which was a little faster for me since I had a friend telling me what everything was, basically.

I have to guess from my experiences compared to how Soldat is now that it won't be too bad for the new players. I mean the new people are already drawn to things like the Barret, which is just same ol' Barret, the M79, no comment, and the Mini, which has gotten better since 1.2. They'll probably then either learn to use a machine gun, or one of the other "two-hit-kill" weapons, depending on style. And none of them have changed dramatically. Most people exaggerate when they talk about the nerfing that took place in 2.3.

All in all, I think everything will be fine, and no one will be the wiser. And as for the vets getting pwnd because of the changes, I think that if any of the vets can't adapt it just shows what poor gaming skills they have. And if the new players can learn faster than they can relearn, than I think that just shows the mettle of the new generation of Soldat players.

~TheRelinquished


I agree with all that you said, especially the adapting to the changes. But as I said above this could pose as a problem by means of 50% of current servers(in Australia) switching to 1.2.1's set of weapon statistics.
And on a side note, has anyone totally changed their weapon choice in the nerw version? In 1.2.1, I always seemed to lean towards the HK MP5 and knife direction, but now I've seemed to ditch the knife for the new and improved chainsaw and Ak 74 combination.

Anywho, nice sig. Looks strangely familiar :p

I think the hardest part of the learning curve for anyone knew to Soldat isn't the balance, but learning everything there 'is' in Soldat.

I mean...christ. We got backflips, throwable flags, bonuses that you rarely see in decent servers, dozens of standard maps, 7 game modes not including survival real mode or advanced, a fully modifiable weapons editor, custom map downloads, and then the confusingly diverse community on top of that, sprinkled with 10 different but equally usable weapons as well as everything else....i'd be one confused noob.

I wasnt that confused when i first started playing: The only thing I knew was pick a game and kill the enemy - Thankfully I wasnt the kind of noob who didnt even know what to do in "Capture the flag"...I mean the name is obvious. Anyways, gamers and people with common sense dont usually have problems with the features of soldat.

Im learning I guess..

Thats right Chakra, but most people learn in a matter of weeks if they are into. By doing so participating in IRC channels, forums, clan recruitment..thats how most people start out to becoming a successful soldat player (Veteran).