[rant]
Aimbots are not feasible in Soldat for several good reasons.
1. Game Physics

Because of the nature of Soldat physics, the velocity and angle of a bullet is always changing and cannot be accurately calculated because of lagtime, as well as the individual arcs of each gun.
By the same effect, players also cannot be accurately predicted for.

2. Server-Side

Because bullet paths are calculated server-side, you cannot change the path of a bullet to make it hit anything, and you cannot move players into the path of your bullet either.

3. Limitations of the Software

Soldat does not use any form of scripting and there are no ways to pinpoint the individual physics of each game object in a precise manner.

4. Effort and Time

Soldat has an incredibly easy learning curve, and its inevitably many many times much faster to learn how to aim the guns than it would take to make a very very poor "aimbot". The math required in itself is a major hassle and anyone with the intelligence and patience to do such a task would realise long before hand that its a waste of time.
[/rant]

I won't claim all the above information is true, as it is based upon my own ignorant understanding of the game client and server (which is pretty poor) and therefore is a representation of my opinon. Feel free to correct me, I like to learn new things.

Do you think they are possible?
Discuss.

Noobs fresh out of Counter-strike always assume that the insanely precise Soldat veterans are using aimbots. Hell, they even accuse me sometimes. I have NEVER seen anything that looked like an aimbot, but I don't know enough of the game's workings to say whether it's possible or practical. The math would definitely be quite a challenge... I think a differential equation is involved, with the air resistance?

The only logic that comes to me is to have the aimbot identify the enemy player and use the a formula of expodential fall (mimicking that of the bullet arch) to determine where the bullet needs to hit. From then on, it would need to calculate the angle at which it would need to shoot the bullet in relation to the identified player. This would require a different aimbot for each weaponm and it would be perfect, nor anywhere near, because there's no real way to determine in which direction or how fast you or the enemy are moving, as both of those aspects come into play in Soldat, as the bullet speed is affected by your movement, and you need to predict where the enemy is headed so you'd shoot him in motion. As far as I know, I don't think such a formula is possible. Or rather, it is (you know, piecable functions; like in a graph, only having a portion of the line / graphed object and using it to create a formula, then using that formula to finish that line / graphed object), though it doesn't seem possible to me that someone could create a hack that kept track of the opponent's speed, direction, and decrease / increase in speed for a fraction of time, then have it analyze, and then have it predict the rest of that person's path all in a matter of milliseconds.

In other words, I believe aimbots could exist in Soldat, but they wouldn't be actual aimbots, as they would miss almost every time.

It's my opinion that an aimbot is possible, it'd simply take very, very long to make, and require an extensive knowledge of Soldat's inner workings. It also wouldn't be very useful for anything, unless it somehow auto-targeted other players, which probably isn't possible.

Barrets are very possible.

Apparently it is possibile. Some dude made it but never released it publicly i think.

More of my opinion

Personally, I will never ever believe an aimbot in soldat unless someone shows me irrefutable proof, i.e. I'd have to able to test it myself. Videos and screenshots aren't very good proof at all because they can both be faked(again, a lot of effort for... nothing), and a demo being a simple recording of soldat's activities (and not third party) wouldn't show anything.

As for people claiming to have made them and "never released them", are proably just people who want attention, like these 'hack' screenshot threads popping up. (Oh look at me! They exist, I made one. Trust me, I wont show it to you or release it to anyone, but it exists!)

Disclaimer: I do not condone the use or creation of hacks, don't make any assumptions.

i think there are auto target bots in soldat where it targets a ppl a shoots but i think it would only work with barrets to have any chance of hitting

ahh, ROFLMAO @ you mister.

I know for a fact they are possible.

all it would need to be is like a heat type seeker cursor where it auto finds soldats and sticks it rite on their dome :/ anyone who used this would be a lame dork and the maker would be an even bigger one to sit there and spend all that time just to cheat in a 2d game rofl :/!

aimbots do exist my mate uses 1 all the time

but soldat is so easy, why would you want to use one?

quote:Originally posted by EnEsCeahh, ROFLMAO @ you mister.

I know for a fact they are possible.


Make one and beat me.

Enesce luv, could you prove that to me?

well I dont have one, but ive sure as hell had one used against me... barreted from other side of B2B :|

what he just hit you once?

and you're going to say: 'no course not you moron i'm not stupid'.

but can you blame me for asking if you're not going to explain what you're saying.

er, what?

jeepers is it really that hard??!

did this aimbot user hit you once from the other side of b2b or more?

i've been nailed once from the other side. doesnt mean im gonna go running round shouting aimbot aimbot.

ew i have a sweaty back :o

EnEsCe, I know Barret users who have memorized angles for blind shots from one side of B2B to the other. They can also use the "bullet-cam" feature of the Barret for very effective trial-and-error. If you see a Barret bullet come whizzing into your base, seemingly at random, you'd better stay on the move because the sniper now knows your location.

your points are valid and I am still struggling with the physics. The arcs are easily predicted and a players next position is also predicted quite well. It still needs tuning tho.

If someone was that clever, why whould he need an aimbot? He whould perhaps create it just to show others how clever he is, but if some people will believe it anyway with no real proof- he succeeds... whats the point in wasting so much effort?

I know how to make one har har har har! The easiest way to make one is to take an pixel search script from an RPG bot used to find an enemy and click on them. Change that to detect the soldat colour on the other teams gostek, and it would basically click on the other soldat. The flaw would be a problem with the map polygons. The bot would end up shooting and hitting polygons right when he sees the enemy, as well as shooting corpses after they die. Also it would be pretty much limited to powerful autos, barret, and ruger do to the straight shot and little arc. It would be fairly slow as well a normal person could probably react faster.

Just saying it is very possible to make a half ass bot that would work well on large flat maps with little work.

quote:Originally posted by EnEsCewell I dont have one, but ive sure as hell had one used against me... barreted from other side of B2B :|

um do u know that barrets can see alot longer and mybe he was camping and saw u go way out there then shot and got lucky

i used to do it when i used barret

EnEsCe is speaking teh truth =)

quote:Originally posted by god2your points are valid and I am still struggling with the physics. The arcs are easily predicted and a players next position is also predicted quite well. It still needs tuning tho.

Told ya.

Poor One Gram. Imagine how he'd feel if he found out that God is making hacks. Tsk tsk tsk.

Like I previously stated, I dont count text as proof. Just because someone says something, means nothing really.

Again, all I wanted to discuss is if you think they are feasibly possible(Nothing can for certain be deemed impossible), not how to make one. :P

I bring this all up because I've seen an overwhelming increase in the number of people blatantly claiming to:
1. Have one / Use one
2. Know how to make one
3. Have a friend who uses one (as if thats cool, or something)
4. Have seen 96546 hax0rs using them (zomg, someday a Soldat comic will be based off this, if there isn't already one.)

While no one really presents any hard proof, and I strongly believe that the proabability is extremely low. Anyway, it seems a lot of Soldaters are convinced of their existence.

look i went to my mates house right he downloaded one off a site opened it went into soldat hit the quick keys and baboom aimbot is working he wasnt even moving the mouse it was aiming for him all he had to do was shoot.

Silly newbies. Silly, silly newbies.

Silly Suasag3 is cool ,just becuse his friend is a SON OF A MOTHER FOOKING SON OF A COW POOPING (Please refrain from swearing) LICKING MOTHER LOVER dose not mean you have to hate on silly Suasag3

cookie said something about hacking into the bots aiming methods : now that is very possible .. If that works youd be a impossible bot with human movement! like the terminator can always hit whenever he see you!

me smells a windup....

Id bet Enesce could make this "aim bot" and all the p00ns would basically suck a cawk to get one cus they have no game. I think this topic should be locked since it is kinda against the rules.

How an aimhack would be implemented
Take it from a programmer who took yr 12 specialist maths, aimbots are possible. The calculations for the bullet arc are easy. To figure out where the player will be you could read the position and the direction + velocity the player is moving at. An advanced aimbot could even take into account the rate of change of velocity to make it even more accurate. Like someone mentioned before, you would need a different aimhack for each weapon though. how it would work is by having a shortcut key to cycle through the players and the hack would set the mouse position so it would aim at the correct place. Then all the user has to do is run around and pull the trigger when they have a clear shot. If someone was really bored they could even make the hack read the map file and work out if there is a clear shot, and if so, shoot for you.

Why none exist
The reason no aimhacks exist or ever will exist for soldat is the fact that you have to find where all the values are kept in memory. The bigger problem is that the memory for these values is allocated dynamically. For all the non-computer nerds this means that getting these values is difficult. To top this off, soldat has a protection against memory searchers which i would love to figure out how to implement. There is a way around this which i will not reveal but thats only useful for statically defined variables, not dynamic ones.
So while its possible to make an aimhack, its extremely difficult and not worth the effort.

To put this simply:
No aimhack will ever be made for soldat.
Anyone who claims to have one is a liar seeking attention

End of discussion.

*giggles* i feel like trawling through tcpdumps now to see how to make one just to proove you wrong ;)

quote:
is the fact that you have to find where all the values are kept in memory


surely some values regarding position, direction, speed (as a mathematician i trust you understand the principles of vector verses scalar quantities ;p ) are transmitted from the server (game you're playing in) to the client (machine you're playing on). which, and i'm just speculating here, if you could intercept and interpret quick enough you could attempt to extrapolate a soldat's current and then predicted position.

as soldat uses udp packets rather than a tcp stream then the packets are readable .....

your main enemy would be lag which is where the positions/actions of the players on your screen are not the true positions/actions that are being calculated on the server. so a player then hops about, as the new information is interpreted by your client machine and this puts the player in his new position. regardless of where his old one was.
people complain of soldat being laggy but i think it actually does quite a good job of keeping sync all things considered.

this is all just speculation mind.... not that i actually know or anything....

yeh uh guys, your taking this too far... stop giving out ways to do it, seriously... no one would waste their time making one for a 2d game anyway, if you want to get an aimbot just use a barret.

quote:Originally posted by EnEsCeif you want to get an aimbot just use a barret.


owned.

And why wouldn't a colour finder work? Set the certain colour of the team (either red or blue) then have a button to scroll through the players... then it just aims at it and you fire when s/he is clear?

Sounds a bit too obvious to me so tell me why its wrong :p

Hmm... You raise a good point. You could intercept the packets and use the information there. However there are few minor issues such as dealing with any form of encrytion IF it exists. I say IF because how would anyone tell if they're looking at data or encrypted data. Without knowing the exact structure of these packets, you would not be able to figure out which section of the packets the data you want is in. Making an aimhack would be impossible to make in a sane amount of time. It would take months of searching and a level of patience not found in any sane person. The only way this could forseeably be done is if the source code was released. And if that ever happened, soldat would be unplayable due to the flood of hacks that would be released.

So have fun trawling through the tcpdumps ahab. I'll expect to see an aimhack in around 6 years with your name on it ;)


edit:

I agree enesce. I am taking this too far. I looked at all paragraphs i wrote and was overcome with a great feeling of sadness :( I am officially a nerd.

Figgy the colour thingy would work to a certain extent but would have problems such as:
- not compensating for enemies movement
- shooting at the flag and at efc's
- not aim at people outside of your screen
- would not aim at people behind scenery
- would aim at some sceneries or polygons
- would not work well in non-team games
- could erratically aim at different players on screen

So in other words it would not aim as good as you.

heh heh

nah won't be me dude ;)

@figgy: a colour finder would be harder, as raven says that necessitates knowing details about a soldat that are located in memory. rather that being transmitted all the time through the magic ether of teh interwebs.

would you STFU and stop giving people ideas you god damn MORON!

quote:Originally posted by i am ahabheh heh

nah won't be me dude ;)

@figgy: a colour finder would be harder, as raven says that necessitates knowing details about a soldat that are located in memory. rather that being transmitted all the time through the magic ether of teh interwebs.


@I am Ahab

You don't need to know details about a soldat in memory, you can search for a pixel with the unique colour on the screen as a way of identifying a soldat

Read the rules.

Topic locked.