I'm pretty sure this has already been suggested before -- most likely by me -- but I'd like to bring it up again anyway...assuming that it has been brought up before.

Experience Mode -- pretty self-explanatory, it's what Advance Mode should have been but never quite became.

Essentially, the longer and better you play, the more experience you get which automatically upgrades your weapons and player (think Enemy Territory, but without the different player classes).

It would be set up like so: each player starts out with less health, speed, ammo capacity, and accuracy than normal. But as they play with each weapon, their stats will increase at each level until they are stronger, faster, and more accurate than the regular mode.

Here's each stat that could be leveled up:
Health -- obviously, at each level the player gains more health; a general stat that levels up regardless of what weapon is being used.
Speed -- the players are slow at first, but then move quickly across the map at higher levels. Also a general stat.
Ammo Capacity -- the more opponents a player kills with a specific weapon, the more ammo they can carry for that weapon.
Accuracy -- the more opponents a player kills with a specific weapon, the less bink he has.
Reload And Weapon Switching Rate -- you should get the idea by now...
Lower Powerup Rates -- for specifically the minigun, law, knife, and grenades; the more you use those weapons, the less time it takes to throw them or shoot them.

Players could be awarded experience for several things:
Killing Enemies -- probably the lowest gain in xp, it would most likely only benefit the weapon stats
Staying Alive -- for, say, each second that you're alive after being shot or killing someone, you gain a certain amount of xp that goes towards your health or speed stat. To prevent someone from camping after being shot and just leveling up without doing anything, the xp gain should terminate after about ten or twenty seconds.
Capping -- a massive boost for your health and speed every time you cap the flag.
Using a Special Skill -- since the only "special skill" in this game would be the barret's scope, this is pretty limited. However, I think it's a good idea to reward barret users more for using the scope instead of just running around shooting people.

And each stat would be separate from each other. For instance, instead of having a fixed point where you level up everything like in most RPGs, each individual statistic would level up on its own. Staying alive increases only speed and health while killing enemies rewards you only for the accuracy, ammo capacity, etcetera, for that specific weapon.

Also, with differing levels of experience comes a great way to shuffle teams so that they're more evenly balanced.

These statistics could be selected to persist for only one whole map rotation or for the entire time that player is on the server. It would also be nice if they were saved for a specific amount of time so that a player can leave and come back if he has to without worrying about losing experience.


So, would you like to try this out or what?

Feel free to add your own ideas (other ways to gain xp, other stats?).

Edit -- To clarify for everyone that doesn't want to read the entire thread: With the exception of the possibility of some program that would save your experience permanently, your xp will reset however often the server is set. This could be by map, by map rotation, by time limit, or for as long as you stay active on the server.

Not only that, but these upgrades will NOT be substantial enough to make you invulnerable. They will make you harder to kill and more dangerous to everyone else, but if you make a wrong move or get hit by an m79/law/barret, you're still going to die.

i reckon its a good idea, itll pull in a new crowd, and make us more commited to one game. plus its something to work for. on the down side it would cause discrimination, "WOO MY LVL 99999 SOLDAT PWNS YOUR LVL3 SOLDAT" so yeah, do we sacrifice civilary for interest

This would be a dream come true for me, because I absolutely adore Enemy Territory's EXP/Upgrades system. If EXP became a default part of Soldat, it would be amazing. This would also add another factor in strategy--whichever team earns more upgrades will probably win. I think that Powerup Rates should be discarded though--it doesn't seem to me that they would make that big a difference.

Maybe it should go like this:

Health: 100% default, 110%, 120%, 130%, 140%, 150%
Speed: 100% default, 105%, 110%, 115%, 120%, 125%
Ammo: 100% default, 15% more for autos, 10% more for semi-autos, etc until last level is reached
Accuracy/Weapon Reload/Weapon switch: 100% default rates, 97%, 94%, 91%, 88%, 85%

Anther upgrade could be Jet Capacity, and level up the same as Speed. :D

We might need to add another filter though, such as Permenant EXP Save, Single Map EXP Save, or [Save Until you Leave] EXP Save.

One more thing though: where will we keep track of our progress? I assume it'll be somewhere along the bottom or side of the screen...

Sounds fun. It remindes me of Enemy Territory when you get promoted.

me likes but, i think michal will have a a heepload of trouble programming it :P

That wouldn't really be motivation for new players to keep playing, would it?

quote:Originally posted by Taali reckon its a good idea, itll pull in a new crowd, and make us more commited to one game. plus its something to work for. on the down side it would cause discrimination, "WOO MY LVL 99999 SOLDAT PWNS YOUR LVL3 SOLDAT" so yeah, do we sacrifice civilary for interest


Not necessarily, the ranks are only temporary.

couldn't you just pwn some bots and get uber speed?
no, its not going to happen.

quote:Originally posted by a-4-year-oldcouldn't you just pwn some bots and get uber speed?
no, its not going to happen.


I think you're all misunderstanding me -- the experience that you gain only works in the server that you gained it in, and only as long as the server allows you to keep it (ie. one map rotation, or one day). Yes, someone might write a server-side program that saves people's experience indefinitely, but that still wouldn't be much of a problem because everyone's experience on that server would be saved, too.

On the other hand, someone could enter a server that just happens to have bots in it, but they'd be leveling up at about the same rate as if they were killing other people.



I just thought of another idea: the game could give more experience depending on how many people you kill. For instance, if you get a multi-kill, you might get three times as much experience.

Good ideas, but as I think of what Steelix just said, it ould stop players from going on to XP servers. I would too, if I joined a server for the first time and got killed by someone who's been levelling up on that server for an hour.
But even so, there should be limits, such as you couldn't be able to run amazingly faster, or have more jet fuel. Not to mention, if one team was smashing the other, in a couple of rounds, it'd be pretty one sided.

I agree %1000

Very nice idea.

quote:Originally posted by Captain BenI would [stop going on the xp servers] too, if I joined a server for the first time and got killed by someone who's been levelling up on that server for an hour.

Naturally, there would be beta testing to balance the uprgrades so that you don't become essentially invulnerable from leveling up. Besides, the upgrades would only give small-scale bonuses, nothing too fancy, but enough to affect your playing experience a little.


quote:Not to mention, if one team was smashing the other, in a couple of rounds, it'd be pretty one sided.


Hence my parallel suggestion for a shuffle by experience option. If it becomes too one-sided, someone can initiate a vote to suffle the players around a little and even out the experience on each team. There might be a problem if the vote gets overruled, but that's why there's the option to refresh players' experience every map rotation or so -- that way, you just have to wait until the experience gets reset and the teams will be even again.

I actually think this shouldn't be a "mode". It should be a totally different patch for soldat. Good idea btw.

If Soldat servers had something like AMX Mod does for steam games, then you could easily create something like this. It would be very interesting to see, I think, though it doesn't fit with the general action-shooter feeling of soldat.

quote:Originally posted by justrude88I actually think this shouldn't be a "mode". It should be a totally different patch for soldat. Good idea btw.

i agree... it seems to have little to do with soldat, though it's a fine idea.. a new patch comes to mind! Please don't go around changing sodlat all to much!

Wolfenstien is almost as fast-paced as Soldat and works fine with this system. :|

man, this would create a skill- fascism isn games! if someone gt a little before the others in kills and such, it would be almost impossible to beat him out of it!

i think this could be fun, and i understand what you're saying.

but can i just say:

what if a player is relativly skilled compared to the others currently playing?

- > how long should he be able to keep killing the others?

by which im thinking that if the other players have crud weapons and health every respawn, and this fairly good chap never has to respawn and has all coolies weapons then the game may self destruct as everyone leaves who cannot kill the good dude.

maybe as a workaround, if there were rounds based on say, 5 lives per soldat, when all players bar the winner have ran out of lives then experience gets reset to 0 for the next round?

thoughts?

quote:Originally posted by i am ahab
by which im thinking that if the other players have crud weapons and health every respawn, and this fairly good chap never has to respawn and has all coolies weapons then the game may self destruct as everyone leaves who cannot kill the good dude.
Didn't Vijchtidoodah say that the EXP would be saved every map/every map rotation/forever instead of going back to zero once you die?

To clarify once again: With the exception of the possibility of some program that would save your experience permanently, your xp will reset however often the server is set. This could be by map, by map rotation, by time limit, or for as long as you stay active on the server.

Not only that, but these upgrades will NOT be substantial enough to make you invulnerable. They will make you harder to kill and more dangerous to everyone else, but if you make a wrong move or get hit by an m79/law/barret, you're still going to die.

I don't like speed & more ammunition; think about it. Those would disrupt people's playing heavily. Everything else pwns, tho'.

is it going to be where you can choose from all guns at once ot will it be like advanced where the more kills the more guns. if its like advanced make it so that you can change the order the guns appear

How about losing some exp if you die,that way people would get taken away from when they die,as well as the killer gaining something

Maybe a the player that has the highest amount of kills at the end of a game would get a little boost also :D

As a mode this will be fun, I freaking hate the concept, but whatever.

LEAVE it as a seperate mode, and ill be fine. However, the soldat population will flood towards experience mode, which might just ruin the other modes.

quote:Originally posted by soldier_playais it going to be where you can choose from all guns at once ot will it be like advanced where the more kills the more guns. if its like advanced make it so that you can change the order the guns appear


You will have the full selection of weapons, just like normal.

quote:Originally posted by Gen0cide` How about losing some exp if you die,that way people would get taken away from when they die,as well as the killer gaining something

Hmmm...that could be worked in some way, like there's a set amount of xp that you lose when you die and your killer gets a percent of your total xp.

However, I don't like the idea of losing experience that way since even the highest kill/death ratios are generally only about two kills for every death. That would drastically sway all the xp towards the more experienced players...which would make this mode extremely unpopular for new players.

quote:Originally posted by ? Maybe a the player that has the highest amount of kills at the end of a game would get a little boost also :D

Great idea, but I don't see the point in giving more experience to a person who is already at the top. Not only that, but I don't want people to just sit around killing people in CTF just to boost their xp instead of going directly for a cap. Proper testing would be able to show whether this is a good idea or not.

oh please, dont make this game into another runescape.
why? because only the best would pwn everybody, and also if they get upgrades they would be really hard to beat!
unless, if u lose all ur upgrades if u die. and u will have to start again as normal.

Numgun, you're about the third or fourth person I've had to tell this to: The experience is only temporary, and any experience you have won't be signigicant enough to make you that difficult to kill.

yea, but health boost, speed, ammo, ect... the skilled dude will just keep getting them and he becomes quite powerful and hard to stop... unless u camp. ; )

But you have to realize that it's practically impossible for only one person to gain all the experience, unless, of course, he's terribly skillful to begin with -- in which case it won't be any different than a normal deathmatch game with that guy. However, I would predict that most games would have a fairly even distribution of experience, so there's nothing to worry about.

To further assuage your doubt: people with more experience still aren't all that difficult to kill. A law, barret, or m79 will still instantly kill even the players who have the maximum level of health, and, even if everyone else in the server has no experience yet, any group of two or more people should be able take even the most experienced player down without much hassle or, at least, harm him enough that anyone else who attacks him will have a pretty fair chance of killing him.

Okay, what about this:

Order of upgrades, goes right every level of skill:

Health: 100%, 110%, 118%, 125%, 130% - gained by staying alive and killing people
Starting armor: 0%, 10%, 20%, 25%, 30% - gained by taking hits
Speed: 100%, 105%, 109%, 113%, 115% - gained by using "special" moves (prone, roll, backflip) while making kills, capturing & returning flags in ctf mode
Ammo: 100%, 105%, 110%, 110%, 115% - gained by killing people
Bink: 100%, 95%, 90%, 95%, 80% - gained by killing people with autos
Reload/Switching: 100%, 108%, 114%, 118%, 120% - gained by using multiple weapons

Hows about that?

Great for a start, xtishereb! Although, most of that will be finalized during beta testing, I'm sure.

[q]most of that will be finalized during beta testing[/q]

What? Somehow I doubt this will be implemented...

There was an assumed "if" in that sentence somewhere.

Edit: That does sound a bit presumptuous, doesn't it.

I like this idea. Maybe a rate improvement too? Weapons in mind would be Ruger,Barrett,SPAS,SOCOM......all the semis

Ooh, great suggestion.

ok, i will agree if the ppl loses all the exp if he dies. /: )

quote:Originally posted by VijchtidoodahGreat for a start, xtishereb! Although, most of that will be finalized during beta testing, I'm sure.
Aww, what happened to mine? :P

Yours was good, too, I just didn't happen to respond to it at the time.

quote:Originally posted by numgunok, i will agree if the ppl loses all the exp if he dies. /: )


Numgun, if you lose all of your experience when you die, then you will practically never level up. You only gain a small fraction of the experience needed to level up for each kill and most people only kill one or two people before they die. Therefore, eveyone will be stuck at the lowest level for each statistic for the entire game.

It just wouldn't work that way.

it should work the opposite way. and give u a handicap depending on how well u play overall

THIS SHOULDE BE A MODE LIKE ADVANCE MODE XD....i agree 100% only you should be able to keep the exp no matter what server...just dont let bots count..like any kills from a 0 ping client besides the server host ect. shoulnd count..therefore being bots :D....but of course this is just in Experience mode....we should call it like Rank mode or somthing i dunno...MICHAL....ADD THIS TO SOLDAT ::THUMBS UP::!

Why not base the starting stats as something below a Soldaten's default stats. That way when you've achieved "perfection" you are only fighting at your peak, not above and beyond the regular Soldaten limits. This would also prevent Michal from having to tweak the anti-hack/cheat detection code.

Lapis, I don't think that the mode should be limited just because it would take more work to produce it. But then again, that's easy to say since I'm not the one actually coding for it.

Interesting idea Sethamundo.

VireX, what inclination would you have to play a mode where you do worse the more you play?

People will eventually dominate the game, making it harder to achieve levels.

Slightly harder, but not impossible. And it would only be a little difficult for people who just entered the game, everyone else would be right behind the most experienced players.

Experience Mode aye...?
Not bad... I like the sound of it.

But I'd suggest you lose less by dying than gain by killing.
Let's say if you have 0 Deaths and 5 Kills...

Then you become 2 times faster and stronger than normally.
(Every 5 kills above deaths would make you stronger)

(4 Deaths; then you'd need 9 Kills to get Power Up)

And if you die you lose 1/5 what you gained.

Which means if you have 0 Deaths and 5 Kills (Power Up)
BUT... If you die you slowly drain the power.

(When your deaths are equal with your kills you are back to normal)

So if you're really good at keeping your kills above your deaths;
Would make you extremely powerful in this mode.

Losing EXP?

Hmm...

Doesn't really sound all that great to me.

Anyways, I have a proposal on how much EXP it takes to gain a level.

Health and Speed/Jet Capacity: 10 EXP, 23 EXP, 35 EXP, 48 EXP, 60 EXP
Ammo: 7 EXP, 17 EXP, 26 EXP, 37 EXP, 48 EXP
Accuracy and Weapon Reload/Switch: 6 EXP, 15 EXP, 23 EXP, 32 EXP, 44 EXP

How much EXP you get with whatever actions:

Killing Enemies: 1 EXP per enemy
Staying Alive: 2 EXP every 5 seconds alive (after being shot, shooting someone, or killing someone, of course)
Cap: Instant level up for Health and Speed/Jet Capacity

What levels what:

Killing Enemies: Ammo, Accuracy, Weapons Reload/Switch
Staying Alive: Health/Speed Jet Capacity
Cap: Instant level up for Health/Speed Jet Capacity

Meh.

quote:Originally posted by YuthThen you become 2 times faster and stronger than normally.
(Every 5 kills above deaths would make you stronger)

Two times as fast is way too high of a powerup, even if it was the highest level that you could get to. I'm talking about small-scale improvements. Remember, we just want players that are harder to kill, not tanks.


quote:And if you die you lose 1/5 what you gained.

I don't like the idea of losing experience...except maybe on teamkills as a punishment.

As for the rest of what you said, half of the people in soldat can't keep a k/d ratio higher than one so your ideas would make it practically impossible for newer players to level up.

It also doesn't make sense. One person could have 0 deaths and 5 kills to reach the next level, while someone else might have 35 deaths and 40 kills. Not to mention the fact that someone could level up initially with 0 deaths and 5 kills, but then be blasted away and have 10 deaths and still only 5 kills. Does that person keep the level that they gained? That's just not the way I see this mode being played.



Chonoryoku, I really like your suggestions, especially the inclusion of a jet powerup.

However, there are two things that bug me a bit:

1) The instant leveling up for capping seems excessive. I'm looking for people to max out on all stats after about six or seven maps, but if someone gets lucky or there's one of those bugs where everyone but a few get kicked from the server, someone could quickly max out on that stat all at once just by capping without opposition.

2) The experience for staying alive. Great idea, but remember that we need to cap it off after a set amount of time so that we don't get campers who were shot once just leveling up for no reason. Other than that, the amount of experience you gain seems appropriate.

Again, this would all need proper testing. Thank you for your suggestions.

I like the idea a lot, a real big lot, but the problem is that if a loser who's played forever goes up against a new and skilled player, the loser is still probably going to win, so a handicap system would also have to be devised, or a method of seperating the different levels to keep the gaming fair.

quote:Originally posted by VeritasI like the idea a lot, a real big lot, but the problem is that if a loser who's played forever goes up against a new and skilled player, the loser is still probably going to win, so a handicap system would also have to be devised, or a method of seperating the different levels to keep the gaming fair.
People that play forever usually aren't losers, and those that are new to the game are not often skilled right off the bat. :|