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Dedicated server source code?
Soldat Forums - Soldat Talk - Game Improvements / Suggestions
Deleted User
January 10, 2006, 3:38 pm
Michal, why don't you make the dedicated server open source? I'm sorry but you're not being able to launch a version that does not contain bugs, errors, failures, that is without mentioning, for example, the creation of a server for Soldat on Linux is very bad and hardly someone less experient will be able to create a dedicated server that registers on ASE, etc, all working.

;)

FliesLikeABrick
January 10, 2006, 5:26 pm
an open-source server would be a very bad idea... it would allow people to hack the soldat client-server protocol and create very effective, unstoppable hacks... not to mention that people could just do very stupid things once they have the source code to the server

DePhille
January 10, 2006, 6:09 pm
If he releases the server code he might aswell release the client code too , it has the same effect as Brick mentioned.
When you have the source-code of the server you also know what data Soldat sends exactly to the server. With that information I'm sure any decent programmer can manipulate an outgoing package from their Soldat game(client) and thus making unstoppable hacks.

Grtz , DePhille

Deleted User
January 10, 2006, 7:51 pm
So I ask you Michal, please, create a dedicated server that runs on Linux without needing SoldatMonitor, Soldatxx, without needing anything, as it runs on Windows. And without bugs, of course. 4 companies here on Brazil quit on opening more than 25 servers, 24h/day, etc because of the bugs and constant bugging of the server for linux, soldatmonitor, etc

FliesLikeABrick
January 10, 2006, 9:06 pm
quote:Originally posted by hunterzSo I ask you Michal, please, create a dedicated server that runs on Linux without needing SoldatMonitor, Soldatxx, without needing anything, as it runs on Windows. And without bugs, of course. 4 companies here on Brazil quit on opening more than 25 servers, 24h/day, etc because of the bugs and constant bugging of the server for linux, soldatmonitor, etc



The one for windows is identical to the one that is for linux... i don't know what you're talking about...


... unless you're talking about the one built into soldat, which you should NEVER use for hosting internet games.

Having a non-graphical server helps the server run better, as well as run in the background... he would have to code an entirely graphical interface for linux in order to make a graphical server, which is pointless, unless he ever makes a linux version of soldat.

To say again, you should NEVER run an internet server using the non-dedicated windows program. It is not updated as frequently and at times contains security holes as well as instability.

Novo Rei
January 11, 2006, 1:15 am
i gave the idea to hunterz...

let dedicated server be open source so many people could work on it to make the developmente faster and solve bugs , etc...

yeah, it could be used to make hacks easier, just easier, already have many hacks for soldat.

in a short time, its possible that many versions of the soldat engine apears, but in the future, the good versions of soldat will be know.

its just because, every new version of soldat has many bugs, crashes and wth8, with linux soldat version thre a lot of bugs, with the windowns thres too

if more people helped to develop soldat, it could be a well-know game with more players and sponsors, soldat is a cool game, revolucionary for a 2D and have many elements of big games

FliesLikeABrick
January 11, 2006, 1:30 am
Novo, I have yet to see any hacks for 1.3.1.

And nobody wants to make it easier for people to make hacks, even if they did/do already exist... i don't know what makes you think it is ok to make hacks easier to make...


I have yet to see the newest server crash, both on windows and linux. If you're using the non-dedicated windows server, that is why it is crashing.

sticky_soldier
January 11, 2006, 1:46 am
I'm going with FliesLikeABrick and DePhille on this one.
If the Dedicated Server source code was released, hackers would be virtually impossible to stop. They might be able to make some sort of a hack which stopped them from getting vote kicked, ping kicked, banned, flood kicked or anything else. They might be able to get the server password and then set the maxplayers to some astronomical number, and then invite everyone in to overrun the server.
No. I'm going with FliesLikeABrick and DePhille.

--
Sticky_Soldier

Novo Rei
January 11, 2006, 1:59 am
thres hacks for 1.3.1 after 1 week of the lauching of the version
thres servers crashes, i was admin of 7 servers, we had to shutdown then because the 7 were buged and crashing, thre were + 2 host servers of 6 servers ( could be 14 if working, one public and another private) all runing on linux, and left just 3 servers that run on windowns, but still have bugs like cant change team, map bug, spwan bug and others, all then dedicated in brazil.

i think soldat come to a point that its not a project or a small game and still not a huge game, and its time to define what its,

hacks cheats etc have in all games, a game without a hack cant be considered a game, and soldat can be improved a lot, im just saying, if more people know the source of the dedicated server, bugs fixes , alternative versions, aditional functions, etc could be created faster, better and diversificated.

and in the same way, hacks would be easier to creat.. anti hacks too, and its not dificult to detect a hack in soldat

sticky_soldier


client side / server side are diferent things
many of the hacks exist because thre are bugs and wholes in the code of the game, i wanna see a hack that hacks the server and gain total control of it....

sticky_soldier
January 11, 2006, 2:15 am
quote:Originally posted by Novo Rei
thres hacks for 1.3.1 after 1 week of the lauching of the version

hacks cheats etc have in all games, a game without a hack cant be considered a game

Didn't some 1.3.1 hack actually come out THE DAY that 1.3.1 was released? That is, Soldat 1.3.1 came out and within 24 hours, a hack had come out for it. I mean, people who have to hack shouldn't play Soldat. If you can't play properly, Don't play at all. In 1.2.1, lots of the players used the reload bug, which has been fixed now, but in 1.2.1, if you had a LAW, you could be firing off missiles at anything up to 5-15 a minute! That is a bug, but in that circumstance it would have been cheating. If you ocasionally used a hack or cheat for fun offline with bots, just to watch their innards explode, well this isn't as bad. But if you play on the internet, you're just gaining an unfair advantage over other players, who, after seeing someone hack, might be less inclined to play Soldat.

"a game without a hack cant be considered a game". I dispute that 100%. Take a look at Stick Soldiers, for example. There are no hacks for that, and I and many others consider IT a game (cue Keron Cyst). (If you don't know what that means, check the WSU forums.)

--
Sticky_Soldier

Deleted User
January 11, 2006, 2:34 am
The bottom line is, if the server source code was released publicly, doom shall reign on Soldat once again but on a much greater and undesirable scale.

FliesLikeABrick
January 11, 2006, 12:37 pm
Novo Rei, can you please answer me about whether you're running the dedicated server or not? I have a very strong feeling that you're running the built-in "dedicated" server, the graphical one.

DePhille
January 11, 2006, 12:43 pm
It seems like you aren't understanding what this would cause.
If you only know just a tiny bit of coding you already know that publishing the sourcecode of a game is one of the stupidest things to do.

Hacks can be made in less than an hour.
Hacks are impossible to stop , not virtually , just COMPLETELY impossible.
Id the dedicated server crashes several times you definitely did something wrong setting it up or configuring your PC to it.

Grtz , DePhille

Deleted User
January 11, 2006, 3:06 pm
I couldn't stop and just walk by this tread withouth posting a question.
Michal once said that he will eventually release the source of soldat,
and i was wondering, will that source be of the latest version of soldat or some 0.x one
cause, if you say that with the realease of a sc of any part of soldat would be nonsense and would bring things like "super" hacks what about the soldat source?

Novo Rei
January 11, 2006, 3:56 pm
of course we were running the dedicated server with the soldat monitor on linux
i think hunterz posted somewhre asking help for these bugs but didnt solve

and its not in a home pc, it was a host server

Pinto
January 11, 2006, 4:47 pm
very efficient I liked your topic huntez !!!

Denacke
January 11, 2006, 6:45 pm
Open source games don't seem to have a hack problem at all (eg. openttd.org). But I do fear it will be a bit harder to make soldat hackfree when going open source.

Seeing as thousands of foreign code would have to be understood and altered to make it hack free, it's one hell of a job.

Perhaps in the future it would be better to start coding soldat from point 0 like openttd did when mimicking the original transport tycoon. It should be possible to get the game as hack free as possible and still having it open source that way.

Deleted User
January 12, 2006, 1:25 am
OMG! lol, i play this game for 4 years and never saw a so buged version, for anyplace u look thres a bug, in the non dedicated and in DEDICATED

I was... and tryed to run the dedicated on many hosters companies and the same things happened, bugs everywhre. And guess what? all started with the 1.3.1 ( thre was minor bugs on last versions, but not so significant)


Configs...

Linux, dedicated 2.4.9
(.ini) "http://www.anjosdobrasil.com.br/arqvs/tms_soldat.zip" (open with wordpad)
maplist (.txt) "http://www.anjosdobrasil.com.br/arqvs/tms_mapslist.zip"

and to check the bugs

Server IP: 200.155.16.184 or 200.155.16.183.
Server Ports: 23073(tm survival), xxxx4(tm normal), xxxx5(inf), xxxx6(ctf), xxxx7ctf(ctf realistic), xxxx8(cw private).

the forwaded ports are correct
all the maps of maplist.txt are corrects as the files "http://www.anjosdobrasil.com.br/arqvs/dd249root.jpg"
soldatmonitor off ( on had bugs too)

And now?
if anyone wanna help, ddzhtz@gmail.com or post here plz!

Yukwunhang
January 12, 2006, 9:30 am
Good job, you played the game before the game existed.

Deleted User
January 12, 2006, 9:40 am
quote:Originally posted by yukwunhangGood job, you played the game before the game existed.

"+/-"
damn...

Dark_Noddy
January 12, 2006, 11:50 am
U want the source released for bug fixing, sure, so U have a bugless server, the price for this MIGHT be that the "major" that joined the game walks on air and trough polys, or he might just crash your server instead... "God mode turn on" would get a new meaning >_>

And at what version did U start to play ?

Hex
January 12, 2006, 12:56 pm
I don't know if opening the soldat source code would be a tragedy. Take the GNU/Linux example, the source code is open and if someone wants to hack some linux machine he has all the data in your hands, but it's rare to happen and when happens, tomorrow this bug will be known by all the world.

But we must know, Linux isn't a project made by just one, it's by a community, that's the point I wanted... If all programmers help Michal make the game better, it will be. The source code don't need to be realeased for everybody, if Michael makes a volunteer programmer team that helps him with Soldat I think Soldat will be better.

thekingkitty
January 12, 2006, 1:31 pm
giving away the source code is like giving away your soul!!

Wilk
January 12, 2006, 3:25 pm
Yeah, release souce code would be sux...

So brick, how can we play others games in same servers? Xx

MM should make a server as this.

FliesLikeABrick
January 12, 2006, 3:41 pm
WillK, I'm not sure I understand what you're trying to ask

Novo Rei
January 12, 2006, 3:58 pm
its just the dedicated server, not the whole soldat

Deleted User
January 12, 2006, 4:44 pm
quote:Originally posted by hunterzOMG! lol, i play this game for 4 years and never saw a so buged version, for anyplace u look thres a bug, in the non dedicated and in DEDICATED

I was... and tryed to run the dedicated on many hosters companies and the same things happened, bugs everywhre. And guess what? all started with the 1.3.1 ( thre was minor bugs on last versions, but not so significant)


Configs...

Linux, dedicated 2.4.9
(.ini) "http://www.anjosdobrasil.com.br/arqvs/tms_soldat.zip" (open with wordpad)
maplist (.txt) "http://www.anjosdobrasil.com.br/arqvs/tms_mapslist.zip"

and to check the bugs

Server IP: 200.155.16.184 or 200.155.16.183.
Server Ports: 23073(tm survival), xxxx4(tm normal), xxxx5(inf), xxxx6(ctf), xxxx7ctf(ctf realistic), xxxx8(cw private).

the forwaded ports are correct
all the maps of maplist.txt are corrects as the files "http://www.anjosdobrasil.com.br/arqvs/dd249root.jpg"
soldatmonitor off ( on had bugs too)

And now?
if anyone wanna help, ddzhtz@gmail.com or post here plz!


Flab, mm, dephille, denacke ...............

DePhille
January 12, 2006, 8:39 pm
There's a huuuuge diffrence in hacking a game and in hacking a program.
You can't really "Hack" a game , you can just 'crack' it , but people tend to say HACKER instead of CRACKER.

That aside , Linux isn't a game , in Linux you can open the received packages and check if they really correspond to reality. In Soldat , for example , you can say that your position is in the centre of the map , while after that you can send a package saying you're at the left side of the map. There is no way for the server to see if that is correct or not , and if there is any it can be bypassed somehow.


Grtz , DePhille

Deleted User
January 13, 2006, 3:55 am
Since releasing the code to the public at large would more likely than not prove pretty disastrous, if MM were to "release" the source, it'd probably be something more like what Intent Software eventually did with Mercenaries of Astonia (which was free) when they took it down and released Astonia III (which is pay-to-play)--there turned out to be significant enough demand for MoA that they started selling liscenses for $500 a pop.
Today there are multiple servers, all free to play, and they each have modified the game in some shape or form... Although I will admit that most of the alterations are changes in the CGI (which holds NPC/item/objects/etc information), map, and graphics, since the actual source code is notoriously evil for having always been devoid of comments.

zyxstand
January 13, 2006, 10:08 pm
i'd say having open source dedicated server is almost as bad as having open source soldat itself. i mean, the code's all there - that's all that counts.