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Better Polygonal environments
Soldat Forums - Soldat Talk - Game Improvements / Suggestions
redhades
July 21, 2003, 4:29 am
SOLDAT's gameplay is awesome and the framerate is great. But one thing that I find so incredebly lame is how the maps are made. It's all just a bunch of trangular faces put next to eachother. No wonder there's always collision problems at the triangle's intersections and sinking surfaces. This makes maping for SOLDAT a real pain.

I think that it should be possible to make maps out of complex 2D polygones instead of a bunch of individual triangles. To start from a real square and be able to actualy attach other faces to achieve smoth and stable surfaces. And if we chose to overlape faces, to have control over the layering of those faces.

Also, texture maping realy neads to improve. In fact, it just needs to exist! Ah, how wonderfull it would be to add different textures to all those surfaces. Imagine creating a complex shape. Then adjusting the color and transparency gradient at each vertex (the point connected by lines). Then maping textures with apha channel to different sections of your structure.

And no more external bitmap problems. Textures should be integrated into the map file. This would greatly facilitate the sharing of map.

Tweak896
July 21, 2003, 6:02 am
i know, i always hate how i sink through the surfaces. SO that should be improved. The texture would be nice too. Imagine all the maps that people would make.

TIR_Blade
July 21, 2003, 11:59 am
Imagine how many newb ones there would be. It would be easier but the triangular polygons r easily managable.

Futile
July 21, 2003, 12:07 pm
I agree with redhades. The system of soldat maps is really lousy. Read this thread about the same subject:

http://archive.forums.soldat.pl/topic.php?topic_id=5711

xav
July 21, 2003, 2:39 pm

I agree

Knuckles
July 21, 2003, 8:52 pm
Agree too.

enjoyincubus
July 21, 2003, 10:24 pm
Ummm...did you ever get a chance to mess around with the Quake Skin Creator and editor? Notice how it uses triangles? That's because it makes sense. It WORKS. If you want a square, then take a triangle, copy and paste and mirror it. Then, BOOM! You have your square.

I know many mappers who have NO PROBLEMS WHATSOEVER with the layout of the map maker. I agree that we need different texture options. I hope that comes in future versions.

But just go into wireframe and poly bugs can be fixed. Easy. I've mapped with it without any "pains" for over 8 months...:)

Maybe I'm just a simple-minded mapper...oh wait, I'm not! :P

Enjoy

Dark_Noddy
July 22, 2003, 12:37 am
me 3 ! I dont do much mapping but the triangular thingies has pissed me off even with THAT little mapping ![:-banghead]

peemonkey
July 22, 2003, 1:15 am
i just started mapping a week ago and i have absolutly no problem with the triangles, mabye some of you just didnt pay attension in 1st grade when the taught about 2 triangles makin a sqaure;)

redhades
July 22, 2003, 3:43 am
quote:Originally posted by peemonkey
i just started mapping a week ago and i have absolutly no problem with the triangles, mabye some of you just didnt pay attension in 1st grade when the taught about 2 triangles makin a sqaure;)

[IMAGE]
Little soldier with texas accent:
"Oh god help me! I'm caught between those two separate triangles. Must be those evil un-welded vertices in the corners right there. Dang! I got fooled by this square allure."

[:D]

Phazon
July 22, 2003, 4:16 am
yeah exactly because of what redhades said its almost imposible to do flat ground with squares like that...

Reaver
July 22, 2003, 9:47 am
It's because of the fact that that's how Direct3D API is designed. Who ever M$-jerk is behind that idea ...

But it would really help if there was some way to further fix the connectionpoints of triangles.
I don't know so much about the Direct3D, so unless I find the time to do some coding with that, no fine ideas about this ...

CbbLe
July 22, 2003, 9:54 am
I would like a eraser...then you can easily wipeout eventually polygon bugs....and some tool for making it easier to make round forms.

juice _ box
July 22, 2003, 9:58 am
im going to agree with enjoyincubus, i have no problem with the current mapmaking program but i would like to intagrate my own scenery into the map file, that would be sexy

enjoyincubus
July 22, 2003, 3:36 pm
You can use your own scenery. Just put the .bmp file in the scenery-gfx folder! Then open the map maker, and it should be in the scenery tab. :D

I don't know if I can explain this, but I'll try...if you want smooth edges, use this technique:

Make a BIG triangle. Then highlight it (click on it) and move your cursor in between the 2nd and 1st vertice. Then hold shift and press the right mouse button. It divides that polygon into two nicer edges...now, if you want to make it smoother, do that same thing over and over again and you will have a NICE SMOOTH poly. ;) (hopefully you can figure it out from there)

Enjoy

BManx2000
July 22, 2003, 4:30 pm
You can do that? SWEET!

TIR_Blade
July 22, 2003, 5:44 pm
Ya u can, Also, I agree with EI that Triangles r easy to use shapes. I don't wanna keep switching between shapes when u can just use one. Also, I agree with Cbble that an eraser would be rather cool.

redhades
July 22, 2003, 7:49 pm
quote:Originally posted by enjoyincubus

Make a BIG triangle. Then highlight it (click on it) and move your cursor in between the 2nd and 1st vertice. Then hold shift and press the right mouse button. It divides that polygon into two nicer edges...now, if you want to make it smoother, do that same thing over and over again and you will have a NICE SMOOTH poly. ;) (hopefully you can figure it out from there)

Enjoy

I'll try that. I knew it existed but didn't think it could help that way. I'll tell you how it goes.

dstruct2k
July 22, 2003, 8:35 pm
Honestly, n00---- I mean, people. Don't do your triangles like this:
[IMAGE]
Have them overlap! If it looks uneven, think about it, grass and mud never IS even! Just learn to live with what you've got, and be glad that we've even GOT a map maker!

Don't like it? Make your own.

TIR_Blade
July 22, 2003, 8:54 pm
XCATELY!!! jesus its good enough as it is.

sauron_the_deceiver
July 22, 2003, 11:39 pm
You complete retards. Polygons are used because they are the most diverse thing to use when it comes to making maps. Think about it - triangles are 3 sided....the first shape that isn't a line ;). This means that, with triangles, you can make ANY OTHER SHAPE AT ALL. Try it. I bet there is no 2d shape you can't make with a triangle. And dstruct is right, overlap your polygons. Michal does say it in the Mapmaker manual :P.

redhades
July 23, 2003, 3:44 am
That's it! Now I?m pissed!
I cant even believe that I?m taking the time to write to all you maper wanabes.

I probably know more about the difference between a triangle and a polygon than any of you little slugs. FOR GOD'S sake, I'm a 3D artist who?s been using professional software like 3D studio max and SoftImage for the past 5 years. I even teach students about this stuff.

So if I say that the mapmaker sucks... IT DOES!!!

Good luck with your little maps ladies! [:X]

juice _ box
July 23, 2003, 4:29 am
some ones a cranky puss.