in relation to this topic: http://archive.forums.soldat.pl/topic.php?topic_id=24658



Hacking in Soldat -mostly now more than before- has got a bit out of hand. Theres been quite an uprise in hacking incidents, far more than i've ever seen in my time in Soldat.

I was playing on the 2wai US ctf3 server, and in the space of one hour I had to ban 3 hackers. Yesterday I banned another, and 2 more from the Euro server just by popping in randomly as a spectator two times in a night. Pure coincidence.


So yeah, the reason of this thread is I just wanna ask Michal: is anything being planned about hacking in this beta?

Don't mean to put you on the spot Michal, and can only thank you for this game i've played more than any other game in my life, but i'm simply curious.




The most problematic and common hack I find most people witnessing, is a speedhack. Very very common, especially in CTF for flag stealing. It's very annoying.

The second most common i've seen is a hack that negates being banned from a vote kick issued against them. Basically, you cannot sucessfully vote kick even when almost all people have voted. I had everyone in a server say they voted, but he was still there, hacking. We had no choice but to leave :|
Incidently, i'm aware I could be mistaken; a server modifying it's votekicking percentage, or disabling it altogether. But I have seen a hack with this description on a website so I can assuredly say it exists.

(The website has since been taken down, thanks to EnEsCe)


The other two hacks that have personally caused me problems this week alone:

One where the hacker respawns in the place he previously died. He still suffers the respawn-time allocated by the server, but none the less spawns where he died.

Infinite fuel in jets i've also witnessed, and is especially noted for it's usefulness in b2b.


As for other hacks which i'm sure exist, i've found people to not use them often, or I simply cannot notice. I'm aware infinite ammo is a possible hack, but have yet to witness it being fully abused.


Can't say I know 'how' these hacks are done, either. You'll have to ask one of the other tech-heads around here about it.

quote:Infinite fuel in jets i've also witnessed, and is especially noted for it's usefulness in b2b.
There was a program postedin these forums a while ago which allowed you to change fuel amounts in maps without using the mapmaker, and let you use a near infinite amount. I used this to make a map for lots of flying. It was discovered soon after that it could be used to change fuel amounts in the default maps, without changing them in any other way, so it would be detected by servers as the same map version. I've since lost this program, but I'm sure someone must have it.

quote:Originally posted by Chakra`
in relation to this topic: http://archive.forums.soldat.pl/topic.php?topic_id=24658

Hacking in Soldat -mostly now more than before- has got a bit out of hand. Theres been quite an uprise in hacking incidents, far more than i've ever seen in my time in Soldat.

Ive actually seen worse times on euro servers, but you are right, its becoming more again.

quote:
The most problematic and common hack I find most people witnessing, is a speedhack. Very very common, especially in CTF for flag stealing. It's very annoying.

I fully agree, speedhack was the most common method (90%+) among the hackes ive seen in the last weeks.


quote:The second most common i've seen is a hack that negates being banned from a vote kick issued against them. Basically, you cannot sucessfully vote kick even when almost all people have voted. I had everyone in a server say they voted, but he was still there, hacking. We had no choice but to leave :|

Im not sure if that is a hack, i havent been able to prove this, because most players didnt reply when I votekicked a hacker as a test on the selfkill inf. I had to manually kick him then.

votepercent was set at 70 or 75%, but there were not enough replies of players to indicate if the vote was successfull or not. In your case it maybe was the votekicking percentage set to a too high amount (so basically the guy voted on wouldve had to vote on himself to be banned).

quote:
One where the hacker respawns in the place he previously died. He still suffers the respawn-time allocated by the server, but none the less spawns where he died.


most of this time where this happened, its been a bug. I actualy havent seen someone doing this repeatedly. If its a hack, its hardly used then.


But yeah, there should be done sth against the increasing number of working hacks for 1.2.1, especially against speedhackers.

That respawning where you have died thing is a hack. I've seen some people respawn in the same place more than 10 times in a row.

quote:Originally posted by Stickyquote:Infinite fuel in jets i've also witnessed, and is especially noted for it's usefulness in b2b.
There was a program postedin these forums a while ago which allowed you to change fuel amounts in maps without using the mapmaker, and let you use a near infinite amount. I used this to make a map for lots of flying. It was discovered soon after that it could be used to change fuel amounts in the default maps, without changing them in any other way, so it would be detected by servers as the same map version. I've since lost this program, but I'm sure someone must have it.


It was me who tested that program for cheating possibilities, the changed map technique only worked if the cheater was hosting - other people would use normal map, but the hoster would be using a hacked version. If a cheater tried to join a server using a normal map, and he had a jet edited version, then he got kicked for wrong map version 5 seconds after joining. Still a cheat, but its not the 'hack' we're looking at here I'm afraid.

According to some sources, the fly hack is still devilishly easy to do, and it's around animation changing. That's why taking out animation checking would be a bad idea ;<

This is very noticable. I, too, have realized that a new "wave" of hackers has appeared. I don't think we have figured out what the source of these trainers / hacks are.

I agree with basically everything Chakra said because I have experienced it myself. I can't be too sure about the vote-kick resistance because I haven't been able to prove it, either. However, I've seen speedhackers who were using the infinite jet hack on as well. I also experienced the spawn-where-you-die hack (also known as a variation of the Walk of Death) just the other day.

The source is probably the latest trainer made by enesce and company. It allowed to do all that.

Assumptions are going to be the death of you.

He is correct. Enesce's last trainer had the ability to do all the things said here and more.

I think Enesce is still secretly distributing these hacks.

I'm gonna prevent the anims hacks and other minor ones but the problem is speedhack and the votekick hack.
I have a problem with the speedhack because I don't know how to detect it succesfully, most mistaken cheat kicks are because the server thought it was a hack but it was lag. Even Counter-Strike has/had a major problem with speedhack.
The votehack - I don't know if this really exists. I haven't seen anything like this and I don't know how it could be possibly done without hacking the server vote percentage. In my oppinon server admins set vote% to 90-100%, the hackers seek servers like this and cheat/waste their lives in them. Enesce's hack only disables the vote box so it is a cosmetical hack.

I don't really understand why people use the current hacks on public servers. I understand if they where in a league and cheated but on a public server?... In version 1.05b the cheats where at least fun, spraying a million M79 grenades was amusing for a while but speedhack??

The speedhack used in Soldat is *just* a modified jumping animation. It could be fixed by improving the animation protection.

About the anti-votekick hack: could it be possible that one type of this "hack" is made so that if a votekick is detected against the cheater and by the cheater, he automatically rejoins the server? I've seen this happen, but I can't be sure if it's a hack or not. Hackers who are voted against sometimes leave and rejoin in a matter of half a second.

Yeah rejoining would work, I'll fix that.

as far as detecting the speedhack... maybe enesce would have some insight into how to detect it (accurately)?

Coincidentally I saw Zenji on the soldat channel and in the screenshot on that Chakra's Number One Fan thread.

I don't think Enesce would know, I think he's just a really patient guy when it comes to programming/hacking. Maybe Ardaen would have some ideas.
The speedhack is a tough problem. I did some research and it is basicly undetectable in Counter-Strike if you use it properly. The same as in Soldat - if you speed up just a bit and use it for a couple of seconds. I can only prevent from using the current speedhack programs but if someone makes a new one then it will be bad. I'll have to make the voting hack-proof.


EDIT:
I found a Soldat cheat while searching the web:
quote:
Multiple guns:
When you start and when it is safe, switch to your SOCOM and drop it
(default is F). It will be replaced with "hands". Then, switch back
to your primary weapon. Find and kill someone, then switch back to
your hands. Then, walk around your opponent's corpse. Most all the
time, you can pick up their weapon. Sometimes the gun will fly quite
a distance away from the corpse. If you can still see it, get it.
You can now switch back and forth between weapons.

LOL!!

i've been cheating all this time? :|

AAAAAAAAAHHHH! YOU CHEATERS!!!!!!! BANBANBAN

quote:Originally posted by Michal Marcinkowski
The speedhack is a tough problem. I did some research and it is basicly undetectable in Counter-Strike if you use it properly. The same as in Soldat - if you speed up just a bit and use it for a couple of seconds. I can only prevent from using the current speedhack programs but if someone makes a new one then it will be bad.

I posted this before, quite some time ago:
I'm not sure about this, but I suppose the speed hack programs don't affect the CPU clock?
You could run a timer in Soldat and compare the time difference with the CPU clock.
Perhaps you could compare the time with the server? NTP time servers?

That's is the problem, the speedhack affects the CPU so there is nothing to compare with. You can only do it with another server, but if lag comes in you can't say if it's cheating or slow connection.

Then you could make it work with good pings only :/

I suppose letting the server check how fast someone may move is a bit difficult.

Surely since they're using the speedhack the client must transmit their current location and direction.

What if Soldat made checks between their old position and new, for example:

First tick:
Soldat's hp/ammo/location/heading

Second tick:
Soldat's hp/ammo/location/heading

Using a grid based system, you could check to see how far they had moved from one coordinate to another within ticks. If the distance they moved is somewhat extreme (for example, lets say five "units") then that sets an invisible flag for that player.

This goes on until he activates the hack again, which Soldat notices and sets a flag. Once he has too many flags, he's auto-voted for possible cheating. It's the best I can think of for a speed hack.

The only issue I can see with that is the possibility of weapon-mod servers using powerful weapons. One blast may propel you past the 5 unit mark. The best I can say is either use a system that determines when they've been pushed by a weapon, or do a bit more extensive speed checking for each player.

Instead of checking to see if they've been propelled by a weapon, you could check to see if they haven't. If they're moving too fast without outside force (lets say the speed equation allows for weapon-based momentum) and this equation doesn't add up to their speed then they're auto-voted. If the weapon momentum is zero and they're moving at 30 units a second then they're obviously cheating.

But what if you nade jump or M79 jump and the server doesn't register that. Obviously you will be moving at fast speed and the server won't know why. Also a check like that will only work if you move very fast, if you move like 10% faster there is no easy way to determine this. There is a ton of stuff that you can do to trick a system that checks your speed.

If you went that way, you'd have to bring back the 'max speed' we used to have in older versions. ie: no m79 jumping, no being boosted from explosions, etc...

I wouldn't mind, but I imagine a few would.



Here's a thought. I've noticed from speedhackers that they have to load it 'before' loading Soldat, and they can only turn the speedhack off after turning soldat off, turning off the hack, then turning Soldat back on again. I know this from a few encounters in the past where i've asked people to remove their speedhack or be banned, and have respectfully obliged.

So seeing as a speedhacker cannot slow down in game (other than stopping), perhaps there could be a way to measure time spent moving at such a speed? Regularly moving at such a speed repeatedly could notify the server. To aid this, perhaps reduce the boost from explosions, or increase the 'slow down' after boosting with an m79.

Or maybe measure acceleration from being still while, somehow, not including external influences (explosions).

about the m79 \ nades boosts..
well, Chakra is right.
if the player ALWAYS moves fast(even on the ground) then there would be a vote to kick him.
you can't be sure if he's a speedhacker after one m79.. so it would check permenetly.
if the player keep moving fast for the WHOLE way that means he's speed hacking ^^

What Chakra` said is sort of what I meant. Obviously, a player moving at an accelerated rate for too long would be a sign of hacking since they'd always be moving at that impossible speed. Small boosts wouldn't be considered since they'd either be between checks or would only last between a short few.

what exactly do they do to make the speedhack work? perhaps this is what you should think about (and preventing them from cheating) rather than thinking about how to catch them doing it.

plus i'm just curious how they manage this

hmm if the speedhack can change CPU speed maybe there is a way Soldat can change it also?

there are speedhacks that can be activated in between aswell, at least there were some for 1.2.0, dunno how they work in 1.2.1

quote:Originally posted by grand_diablothere are speedhacks that can be activated in between aswell, at least there were some for 1.2.0, dunno how they work in 1.2.1

The one I tested (I think it was "SpeederXP") lets you change the speed using hotkeys. For example you'd have keys for +1000 speed, -1000 or normal speed. It worked flawlessly, however I haven't tested it in any of the newer versions.
I'm hoping for some kind of trick, like windows having an event that lets you check if the speed has been changed or something similiar.
Michal, maybe you/we can find out how exactly the speed programs work and try to work on from there?

I can't find any info on the net. Maybe post on some hacking/programming forums with help on developing a speedhack program?

Anyone found any help?